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| From: | WTOadmin1 | 1/22/2007 9:13 am |
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(1 of 419) | | | | 2506.1 | |
The discussion below is now closed. Please feel free to participate in the user-initiated forums.
The Doha Round: Join a discussion on the prospects for the negotiations
In July 2006 the Doha Development Round negotiations were suspended. Calls to resume the negotiations as soon as possible have come from various forums around the world but the future of the negotiations remains highly uncertain. The WTO welcomes the opportunity to hear YOUR views, and to answer your questions, on the prospects for concluding the Doha Round.
Edited 6/30/2008 4:29 pm by WTOadmin |
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| | | | | 2506.2 in reply to 2506.1 | |
Earth First
Edited 1/22/2007 8:54 pm by Vanclaren
Edited 2/27/2007 1:08 am by Vanclaren |
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| | | | | 2506.3 in reply to 2506.1 | |
WTOadmin1
Perhaps if Doha's success could be sold as a preliminary step towards keeping interest in the WTO followed by the rewriting of its rules, Doha would be more palatable to the various members trade negotiators especially in the United States and France.
The WTO rules are outdated and no longer serve to promote fairness in trade between nations. Even the anti-dumping provisions lack relevance. It could be a good time to simply say Doha is good but our next step is to revise the rules to allow it and international trade in general to work.
On a personal note, I do not see what all the fuss is about when it comes to Doha. Possibly Doha and how the WTO rules function are simply not understood by voters in democratic countries who weigh heavily in politician's decisions. The voters notice the ill consequences of globalization and equate this to becoming worse under Doha.
Somehow, the WTO has to frame Doha in a context understood by the average citizen. It would follow that there is also a need to explain why they are confronted with environmental degredation and labour abuses that give the offenders an international trade advantage over those in more responsible societies.
Question 1. What exactly does the WTO expect from a successful conclusion of the Doha round and exactly how will the expectations be achieved? It would be nice to see a benchmark set here and now so we can measure the effectiveness of the WTO's rules based system in years to come.
Question 2. Doha is being sold as having an "environmental" component to it. All I can see is that the members agree to discuss the environment and nothing more. Am I missing something?
Question 3. Elimination of agricultural subsidies under Doha is touted as good for the environemnt. How? At a time with so many starving people in the world should we be cutting back on food production? Also, won't the removal of the subsidies increase the cost of foreign food aid? Could this not result in a reduction in aid?
Thank-you,
Syd Martin
Edited 1/23/2007 7:02 pm by SydMartin
Edited 1/27/2007 5:39 pm by SydMartin
Edited 2/5/2007 9:52 pm by SydMartin |
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| | | | | 2506.4 in reply to 2506.1 | |
I share WHOLEHEARTEDLY former U.S. President Bill Clinton's view toward embracing the peace and wealth sharing that result from open trade, but he was right in 1999 when he told delegates that trade proponents like himself were doing a poor sales job. This could be because trade law is so complex. It isn't even taught in at least two of Canada's biggest law schools! How on earth do developing nations figure out these procedures and how to use them to their advantage, I wonder?
I very much appreciate the WTO's continued efforts to expand its website and increase info accessibility both online and in print. Good work indeed.
One suggestion: Create a new link that includes a one-para. summary of each measure actually changed to comply with a DSB panel ruling, i.e. Canada's extension of the patent protection period. The U.S. is frequently called to account for poor WTO compliance but it might be enlightening compare the substance of measures it's asked to 'fix'. Many websites track the percentages but not the actual substance. Such a link would be a tremendous bonus as WTO decisons are hundreds of pages long.
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| | | | | 2506.5 in reply to 2506.1 | |
Dear Sir or Ma'am:
I am delighted to see that this posting on this forum. I believe there are member initiated threads that directly and indirectly address your question.
Assuming that the Doha round is only one of many formative rounds of negotiation. I say formative because, the WTO, like all "new" international organizations, must evolve as the needs of the international trade community become better known. The recent failure of the Doha round is indicative of the need to change.
May I ask why you are limiting your solicitation for input to just the Doha round? Your approach is one that seems to say, "Complete this round, and all will be well with the world." What has your analysis of why the round failed in the first place shown? Did it consider that possible structural flaws in the WTO led to the failure?
MarkK
Trade in Harmony for the Benefit of all. |
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| | | | | 2506.6 in reply to 2506.1 | |
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There are seven major reasons why the WTO must be stopped and bilateral or country group agreements substituted.
Sustainability
Free trade implies that the market goes to the lowest bidder regardless of sustainability. So for exampel small growers of palm nuts for palm oil are having their livelihood destroyed by people establishing plantations in Indonesia, in the process destroying the rainforest.
The import by poor countries of goods ( e.g. SUV’s) that are not necessary at the point of development has been discouraged by many countries by luxury taxes. Products do damage to the World GHG and the local economies by reducing the tax base so that public transport, a more sensible alternative, cannot be provided.
GHG, fish stocks, trade in hardwoods, pollution etc are other examples where trade must be managed, not be free,
When Haiti, under US pressure reduced rice duties, local farmers were put out of business because small scale production is intrinsically more expensive than large scale production. But the externality of this was instability.
Race to the bottom.
This has been well documented. International capital and machines are mobile. When it is no longer cheapest to produce in one country the machines are put in containers and moved to the next country. This results in both human and structural externalities. The government may have invested in infrastructure to support the new industry only to find 3 years later it is gone. There is a huge international surplus of unskilled labour. In the histories of our democracies unions and licensing counterbalanced the trend to ever lower wages and during the great depression through government intervention industrial leaders were forced to raise wages. Neo-liberalism gave rise to acute problems then and is now under the situation where the World population is doubling every 50 years or so, but the Worlds natural resources are not.
Destruction of social strurctures.
The alienation felt by many people with regard to the non-continuity of ecoonomic life gives rise to disintegration of the forces that hold societies together. Families, local leaders, community activities.
This has externalities such as the losers in the trade wars resorting to violence, gang activities, setting up rogue states.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20070126/wl_csm/otrabx
‘globalisation must be managed with greater justice’
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/2797405.stm
Redistribution of wealth.
All the data is that trade redistributes wealth towards traders and plantation ownere. In South America a few controlling families own the majority of the land.
Democracy
Democracy has been the foundation of the World’s emergence from Fascism and Stalinism. Yet the non-accountability of the MNC’s is destroying democracy. The examples are numerous.
Disregard of working conditions.
Cocoa production in West Africa, the Bangladesh carpet industry, production of Appple I-pods in China. There are numerous examples of disregard of working conditions in international trade.
Domination by capitalist thinking.
"Capitalist economics is an unreliable process of booms and slumps, and an unpleasant process of competition, where those who win necessarily do so at the expense of those who lose. Within an economy or economies structured along these lines convergence is not possible. The Green vision of a steady-state economy, where goods and services are provided locally and without economic growth in economies that have already reached their sustainable level, suggests that such convergence over the long term might be possible. We suggest that the government consider such an economic vision as a serious alternative to the capitalist, competitive economic culture that now dominates almost all political thinking. This would have the positive side-effect of prioritising the well-being of the planet and all its people over the profit-making of the few who dominate the present economy."
"Renato Ruggiero, former Director-General of the WTO, stated that trying to stop globalisation is ‘tantamount to trying to stop the rotation of the earth’. We would suggest that the government should take a more flexible attitude towards economics and explore the model of decentralised, self-sustaining local economies outlined in works such as those by Richard Douthwaite and Herman Daly (see list below). "
http://www.greenparty.org.uk/files/reports/2003/fivetests.htm
There must be a movement away from the culture of consumerism.
The WTO is leading us down the path of destruction of the planet, increased conflict, the desruction of democracy, and a new type of facism, combining autoritarian controls ( the WTO rules ) with domination by the MNC's and various ruling elites.
Trade must be of mutual benefit the the peoples of the two trading countries. A win-win situation. WTO rules are providing too many loosers as the planet experiences economic growth but at the same time doing nothing to reduce huge inbalances in power and huge poverty, and soon large increases in violence levels through social and political instabilities will follow. They are also destroying the planet and democracy.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6096084.stm
WTO rules need comprehensive revision to take considration of individual trades, their exteralities, including welfare, environment, sustainability, effect on democracy.
If anyone reads this at the WTO I hope they do what they can to stop the train before it is too late.
Lamy makes no sense to me. He represents the worst of international personnel with fat pensions and no real experience of life. Of course if I have spare pig-meat and my neighbour has spare corn I choose my neighbor to trade with rather than someone at the other end of the planet.
My suplier in some distant land may not be there tomorrow or may be offered a slightly better price destroying my business. Oil or shipping prices may rise or there may be a war.
So why is it that somone with such command of languages and much intelligence is so devoid of common sense?
Bilateral agreemens are nearly always better.They are polically and democratically responisble and they aloow for re-negociation shoul problems follow....[Message truncated]
Edited 1/30/2007 1:44 am by compasoft1 |
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Message 7 of 419 was Deleted
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| | | | | 2506.8 in reply to 2506.1 | |
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wtoadmin1 ,
Uncertain ? now , the population from planet Earth at this present time need certain , need security , need help because all the agreements , trades negociations , business around the world , around the financial markets , since long time ago when the developed contries need to obtain their sustainable development they ( markets policies ) (did and stll are doing, everything to" conqueur " their ( developed countries ) place number one in the market trades , value money , and all securities that is possible for theis populations , and so........ what to do now if all this WORK has a consequence not so GOOD because the developing countries are still paying for this interes that are so high and the population from developing countries don t find safe for a dignity life , for their family , their history , their future ... and the other consequences are the barriers , tecnical , investment , and specially services , they , developing countries wish Work and so....... the population only find the work , job in the developed countries ... and now there is a BOOM SERVICES , CRISIS SERVICES , and so........it is simple .. WTO need to give hope and to obtain more flexibility to developing countries and a CHANCE to them by temselves have a sustainable developing , only for the necessary and it , will be a big trade for them and their population ,,,,,,,,, good relations and peace .....
cristina . |
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| | | | | 2506.9 in reply to 2506.1 | |
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Dear WTO admin1
Thank you for the invitation to address this topic; and for this well-designed forum in general.
Some of my comments here echo the some in pervious posts. I hope my entry is not too long or too inaccurate.
Reviving Doha
R.Vanclaren
I. Coexistence of 'Global Trade' and 'The Natural Earth':
While I am far from an expert, the more I study, the more I am convinced that the WTO places disproportionate weight on the idea that 'Unfettered International trade is, in itself, the best path to global stability and political harmony between nations'.
At the same time, it (the WTO) seems to hold little appreciation for the context, or 'field of activity' on which this commerce is carried out. If so, I would submit that this is a big mistake; because it is only by virtue of this 'field of activity' that this commerce is at all possible....or meaningful. [All this is posed in a purely philosophic sense; but the philosophy here is 100% applicable to reality.]
It is a little like playing a game of chess and disregarding the fact that the checkered gameboard...('the field of activity')... is, itself, crucial to the game. Actually, it is natural to neglect the importance of the chess 'gameboard' when you are concentrating on checkmating your opponent's king. Though some might argue that "the board is the most important element of the game", since (a) without the board, the game is not possible; (b) since the rules (and movements of the pieces) are fashioned around the dynamics of the board; (c) since the underlying object of the game is not just to topple the opponents king, but to take possession of the board--like conquered territory.
I would argue, however, 'that the game and the board must necessarily co-exist (equally); before either can exist in any meaningful way. Their coexistence, in other words, precedes their meaningful existence. Hence, each should be regarded with equal respect.
In the case of global trade, the natural Earth serves as the 'field of activity'. The vitality of the natural Earth is as essential to global trade as the chessboard is to a game of chess. Yet, within the basic policy of the WTO, [from what I see] the natural Earth is pretty much taken for granted. Any provisions of protection, preservation, or maintenance of the living Planet--and its resources--seem to be 'tacked on'--(bit by-bit)--to basic WTO policy; (as it becomes undeniable that such provisions are needed). When, I would submit that these conservational provisions should be serving as the very foundation for all WTO policy.
Otherwise...how can you gauge if WTO policy is realizing 'solutions'...or, in fact, creating more problems?
II. Synergetic Development and Raising Standards of Living
As you know well, the first paragraph in the preamble of the WTO agreement reads:
"The Parties to this Agreement,
"Recognizing that their relations in the field of trade and economic endeavour should be conducted with a view to raising standards of living, ensuring full employment and a large and steadily growing volume of real income and effective demand, and expanding the production of and trade in goods and services, while allowing for the optimal use of the world’s resources in accordance with the objective of sustainable development, seeking both to protect and preserve the environment and to enhance the means for doing so in a manner consistent with their respective needs and concerns at different levels of economic development...."
Considering this ambitious mission, I think it is reasonable to ask, 'What WTO policies actually support these aspirations?'; particularly in the areas of:
(A)"...raising standards of living";
(B)"seeking both to protect and preserve the environment"; and
(C) "...[being] in accordance with the objective of sustainable development."
While this same 'Charter' [if that's what it is] goes on for another forty or fifty paragraphs, I see no further mention of "sustainable development"; "raising standards of living'; or "preserving and protecting the environment"...beyond this first paragraph. These topics are not even alluded to th...[Message truncated]
Edited 2/1/2007 7:08 pm by Vanclaren |
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| | | | | 2506.10 in reply to 2506.1 | |
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WTOadm1 ,
If you control the education you control the harmony and equilibrium for the enviromental .
. Global Warm is another consequence : the population from the Earth is feeling the changes climate , and it is a very important topic , the industries must have the responsability to stop , to moderate ( moderar ) , this changes , because this is affecting everybody , anywhere around our PLANET , we leave here ... and so... we need air , we need oxigen to stay alive .. and so .. this must be rule NUMBER ONE FROM TRADES NEGOCIATIONS , RESPONSABILIDADE , RESPONSABILITY , WITH ENVIROMENTAL , WITH LIFE , ANIMAL LIFE , HUMAN LIFE , VEGETAL LIFE ..
THE national legislations and international legislations must be in harmony with each other to obtain "atitude " this is FACT , FACTUS , FATO .
. Informazione , education to the population from the planet both Developed , developing , poor , countries , the gorvenmets need to be responsable to educated about this problem because a lot of people witH "CONHECIMENTO " , FARÁ A DIFERENÇA , WILL DO THE DIFFERENCE AND THE CHANGES WILL GO TO THE RIGHT WAY , with motivate , that with knowledgemwnents , "conhecimentos " , the population from developing countries will obtain security to STAY WHERE THEY WERE BORN , THEIR LAND , NOBODY WISH TO GO TO ANOTHER LAND TO SURVIVE TO OBTAIN MONEY FOR THEIR FAMILY BECAUSE THIS KIND OF SERVICES ARE HAPPING , THE DEMAND FOR "JOBS " FROM DEVELOPING COUNTRIES TO DEVELOOPED COUNTRIE HAPPEN EVERYDAY AND THIS IS SAD FOR EVERYONE , EVERYWHERE , EVERYBODY WISH STAY BESIDE THEIR FAMILIES , THEIR HISTORY , THEIR LAND .. AND SO....WTOADM1 KNOWS BETTER THAN I THAT THIS CONSEQUENCE MUST STOP AND TO OBTAIN "RESULTADO " RESULT , a great result WTO need to Create another rule : Education from governement with responsabilitie and penalties entre trades negociations btween import and exports .... the consequence from EDUCATED IS SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT TO THEY STAY IN THEIR LANDS , AND HAVE DIGNITY .. beginning and this will obtain more equilibrium for developed countries ..
. The Adaptations must continue , this is NATURAL , THE RULES MUST BEGINN TO ADAPTED WITH THE PRESENT HISTORY OF CIVILIZATION .... THE CHANGES ARE COMING ...
Regards ,
Cristina Saviano . |
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| | | | | 2506.11 in reply to 2506.1 | |
I am confident that Doha round would be successful ultimately and there would only be delays. I had initiated discussion called as CHALLENGES OF DOHA AND BEYOND already wherein you find many views. US and EU should compromise on agricultural issues. Hope they had already become flexible for successful Doha Round.
Sreeram |
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| | | | | 2506.12 in reply to 2506.2 | |
| The WTO would be delighted to receive your input. Please tell us more. |
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| | | | | 2506.13 in reply to 2506.12 | |
jcg6
If you are in fact with the WTO, what is it that you would like to hear in response to your initial posting? This would be interesting to know and I am sure your response will be also useful to smushty in understanding the scope of the reply being sought from him.
Syd Martin
....The WTO welcomes the opportunity to hear YOUR views, and to answer your questions, on the prospects for concluding the Doha Round. |
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| | | | | 2506.14 in reply to 2506.12 | |
I had to complete the dissertation on the topic "CHALLENGES OF DOHA AND BEYOND". Please let me know your association with WTO. I am always hopeful that DOHA round should be a success coupled with an opinion that the function of WTO is a continuous exercise. You find my inputs in the initiated discussion 'CHALLENGES OF DOHA AND BEYOND'. If you have any specific opinions or queries raise under that discussion or under this discussion then I can put forward my inputs. I would be happy if you sponsor my work coupled with a stay for 30 days at WTO if you are at WTO.
Sreeram
Edited 2/12/2007 3:06 pm by smushty |
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| | | | | 2506.15 in reply to 2506.5 | |
| The Round has not yet failed and achieving success in these negotations will certainly not solve the problems of the world, or even of poor countries. You are quite right in that assertion, but achieving a result in this Round will go a long way to re-balancing the trading system to enable poor countries to take advantage of its opportunities. As for input, this particular forum is about the WTO Round but we welcome input on any WTO subject and there will be other WTO forums soon that will go beyond the Round. As for the consequences of failure they are sadly quite numerous and will be felt most of all by developing countries. |
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| | | | | 2506.16 in reply to 2506.11 | |
| I share your confidence but the negotiations also require developing countries to also provide better access to their markets. The Round will succeed if there is a win-win situation for all the 150 Members of the WTO. |
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| | | | | 2506.17 in reply to 2506.13 | |
| there was reference to some specific proposals - which it would be good to receive. |
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| | | | | 2506.18 in reply to 2506.15 | |
jgc6
Perhaps rather than saying the consequences of Doha's failure are "numerous" combined with your belief in the importance of Doha, it would be an opportune time to inform us of the consequences of failure.
Syd Martin
Edited 2/12/2007 9:01 pm by SydMartin |
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| | | | | 2506.19 in reply to 2506.1 | |
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Sustainable Development vs. Synergetic Development
I was somewhat encouraged by Mr. Lamy's recent address to UNEP Global Ministerial Environment Forum (Nairobi on 5 February 2007). And I liked how he introduced the Lovelock principals of Gaia into his speech. http://www.wto.org/english/news_e/sppl_e/sppl54_e.htm
I thought, it was particularly appropriate how Mr. Lamy connects Lovelock's ideas with his own push for sustainable development. The Gaia hypothesis -- that our planet is, in itself, alive; "...that the Earth responds to provocation...air, oceans and land surfaces react in the face of threats to their very existence,"--fits right into the context of 'sustainable development'.
In doing a little research, I was surprised to learn that Gaia and Terra were one and the same. Terra, I had known all along, was the Earth...or Roman goddess there-of. But this 'on-line' article from 'Encyclopedia Mythica' .... tells the broader story. http://www.pantheon.org/articles/g/gaia.html It ends:
Gaia being the primordial element from which all the gods originated was worshiped throughout Greece, but later she went into decline and was supplanted by other gods. In Roman mythology she was known as Tellus or Terra.
An interesting parallel, I thought, that She should first give birth to the gods; then stand beside them as an equal.
We humans, become irritating nits on the surface of the Earth when we increasingly combine instant-profit-oriented economy with our powerful technological tools. Lost in this occupation, we forget that Gaia would as soon sweep us away as continue to nourish us; for She, apparently, has little use 'economic growth'.
Translating from mythology to the simplest physics: 'the greater the action-force in one direction, the greater the reaction-force in the opposite direction'; So to flow with the direction of nature--as on a river down stream--poses the least provocation to Gaia. And it is no coincidence that principals of 'sustainable development' sets us on that down-stream path...aligning our actions with those of Gaia.
The question is...How to make 'Sustainable Development' so appealing, that every WTO member-nation will rush to it as if it were a bucket brimming-over with gold and diamonds...fresh for the plucking.
Keeping in mind the Brundtland definition: 'Sustainable Development is the development that meets the needs of the present [generation] without compromising the ability of future generations to meet their own needs, we need, I think, to put forward a convincing case, illustrating that every WTO member-nation (regardless of their stage of economy) will prosper more...right now...by assuring the prosperity of future generations.
For starters, in that vein, I think we might drape sustainable development in new attire--a princely robe...that out-sparkles every incentive that drives WTO policy today. And that, that attire might come in the form of a new name: Synergetic Development.
Because, let's note: When we analyze the Brundtland definition of sustainable development (above), we see that it can only be accomplished by applying principles of synergy to it. That is, when we take into account...
a) the Earth is a finite system, retaining finite resources; and
b) that future generations, by most trends, will have considerably larger populations,
it becomes obvious that these future generations will need to 'do more with less'--which, of course, is the exact definition of "synergy". In other words, sustainable development necessitates synergetic development.
The above observation is significantly strengthened by the well-founded assumption that we (our generation) endeavor to raise the standards of living for the generations that follow. (I say, "well-founded" because that 'objective' is clearly stated in the WTO preamble...in its very onset.) http://www.wto.org/english/docs_e/legal_e/04-wto_e.htm
[If, on the other hand, we (our generation) wanted lower standards of living for our posterity, then neither sustainable or synergetic development would be an issue.]
The point is, that changing "sustainable" to "synergetic", gives clarity to the type of development that we are looking to undertake....(and, in fact, must undertake to reach the defined objectives of 'sustainable development'.) It is a more accurate description of the mission at hand. And now--by this change of wording--we have added a new dynamic; and hence, require a new definition for the challenge ahead:
"Synergetic development is the development that meets the needs of the present generation while enhancing the ability of future generations to meet their own needs."
This is the pot of gold; because, where sustainable development demands, at he very least, 'restraint' or conservation, "synergetic development" demands, at the very least, 'a high degree of creativity'--creative thinking and creative doing. The new approach presents a formidable challenge to every WTO member nation, to innovate and develop techniques and technologies with higher and higher standards of efficiency. Prosperity, here, is fueled by vigorous cooperation towards a meaningful challenge--a receipt for prosperity that we have seen work, many times throughout history.
This means that no longer is 'trade for trade sake' an applicable approach to national or global enrichment...in fact, it becomes petty. Trading apples for kumquats simply does not, in any way, contribute to the development of a nation...or global community. A nation (or anyone) does not develop by doing what is "easy" but by doing what is "hard". So, I would think that synergetic development offers a clearer vision for WTO policy....[Message truncated]
Edited 2/13/2007 5:54 am by Vanclaren |
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| | | | | 2506.20 in reply to 2506.5 | |
Mark,
I thought you may be interested in the below articles. The US has finally singled out the country who does not trade fairly (and doesn't have to given the current WTO rules have no provisions to prevent currency manipulation and as for the subsidies, US businesses will sink by the time it gets before a WTO panel let alone having a decision rendered) and is the true source of Doha's struggle. My best guess is China will once again tell the US to take a walk at which point I seriously doubt the trade promotional authority will be extended to the US President.
I have noticed you have yet to have your questions answered.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/reuters/070212/us/politics_usa_bush_economy_report_dc
http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/news/editorial/16669332.htm
It is interesting watching this unfold.
Syd Martin
Edited 2/13/2007 2:52 am by SydMartin |
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