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From: Chris54s  Nov-7 12:15 pm 
To: ALL  (1 of 149) 
 105229.1 

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/11/congressional_budget_office_th.html

"The Democratic bill, in other words, covers 12 times as many people and saves $36 billion more than the Republican plan."

 
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From: willie_p  Nov-7 12:23 pm 
To: Chris54s  (2 of 149) 
 105229.2 in reply to 105229.1 
The only plan the Republicans really have is to make sure we get no plan. They had 10 years of majority rule, six with a Republican President and did nothing. Their only reason for submitting a plan now is to muddy the waters and delay or prevent anything from being done.
 
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From: Chris54s  Nov-7 2:22 pm 
To: willie_p  (3 of 149) 
 105229.3 in reply to 105229.2 
I think it backfired, it ends up with less people covered. Ridiculous.

 
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From: Cannon  Nov-7 5:51 pm 
To: Chris54s  (4 of 149) 
 105229.4 in reply to 105229.1 
doooooooooosh
 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 5:52 pm 
To: Chris54s  (5 of 149) 
 105229.5 in reply to 105229.1 

Let's hope the Dem's bill doesn't pass.

It is the beginning of the end for the Republic.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: Wertherino  Nov-7 6:16 pm 
To: TheRealMcKoy  (6 of 149) 
 105229.6 in reply to 105229.5 
what's it like being a CEO?

_________________

PHAITH!

 
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Message 7 of 20 was Deleted  

 
From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:14 pm 
To: Wertherino  (8 of 149) 
 105229.8 in reply to 105229.6 
I'm not a CEO. I stand up for the Republic, as Hamilton envisioned it.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: SpicyMcHagis  Nov-7 7:16 pm 
To: TheRealMcKoy  (9 of 149) 
 105229.9 in reply to 105229.8 
Hamilton was a British loyalist. Aaron Burr challanged him not only politically on that, but to a duel. The entire Whig party was a bunch of British loyalist. Damn now I sound like I am back in Northern Ireland.

Never backdown!!!!! No Surrender!!! (Loyalist motto)
A Róisín ná bíodh brón ort fé'r éirigh dhuit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN3weW1udE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJEySrDerj0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyQRprA4NQ

RIP Bronwyn Erin Danniells

 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:17 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (10 of 149) 
 105229.10 in reply to 105229.9 
Whig party wasn't founded until 1833.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: SpicyMcHagis  Nov-7 7:19 pm 
To: TheRealMcKoy  (11 of 149) 
 105229.11 in reply to 105229.10 

Check again. John Adams was the first Whig President. It was reformed in 1833. Here's a list of some of the orignal memebers and Mr. Hamilton was a very happy member.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_(American_Revolution)

Never backdown!!!!! No Surrender!!! (Loyalist motto)
A Róisín ná bíodh brón ort fé'r éirigh dhuit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN3weW1udE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJEySrDerj0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyQRprA4NQ

RIP Bronwyn Erin Danniells

 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:22 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (12 of 149) 
 105229.12 in reply to 105229.11 
Adams and Hamilton were Federalists, not Whigs. That is a broken link.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: SpicyMcHagis  Nov-7 7:24 pm 
To: TheRealMcKoy  (13 of 149) 
 105229.13 in reply to 105229.12 

I will send it to you again. They were called Whigs, but several protested the name because Whig is a party in the UK so they compromised and called themselves Federalist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whig_Party_(United_States)

Never backdown!!!!! No Surrender!!! (Loyalist motto)
A Róisín ná bíodh brón ort fé'r éirigh dhuit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN3weW1udE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJEySrDerj0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyQRprA4NQ

RIP Bronwyn Erin Danniells

 
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From: SpicyMcHagis  Nov-7 7:26 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (14 of 149) 
 105229.14 in reply to 105229.13 

Here I had to copy it. Won't let you re-direct.

Patriots (also known as Americans, Whigs, Revolutionaries, Congress-Men or Rebels) was the name the colonists of the British Thirteen United Colonies who rebelled against British control during the American Revolution called themselves. It was their leading figures who, in July 1776, declared the United States of America an independent nation. Their rebellion was based on the political philosophy of republicanism, as expressed by pamphleteers such as Thomas Jefferson, Alexander Hamilton, and Thomas Paine.

They called themselves Whigs after 1768, identifying with members of the British Whig Party, i.e., Radical Whigs and Patriot Whigs, who favored similar colonial policies.

As a group, Patriots comprised men and women representing the full array of social, economic, ethnic and racial backgrounds. They included college students like Alexander Hamilton, planters like Thomas Jefferson, merchants like Alexander McDougall, and plain farmers like Daniel Shays and Joseph Plumb Martin.

Those colonists who remained loyal to the British Crown called themselves Loyalists or "Tories" or "King's men." In addition, many people remained neutral or said nothing.

Many Patriots were active before 1775 in groups such as the Sons of Liberty. The most prominent leaders of the Patriots are referred to today by Americans as the Founding Fathers of the United States.

Contents [hide]
1 About the Patriots
2 No taxation without representation
3 List of prominent Patriots
3.1 Statesmen and office holders
3.2 Pamphleteers and activists
3.3 Military officers
4 See also
5 Bibliography
6 References

[edit] About the Patriots
The Patriots came from many different backgrounds. Among the most active of the Patriots group were highly educated and fairly wealthy individuals. However, without the support of the ordinary men and women, such as farmers, lawyers, mechanics, seamstresses, homemakers, shopkeepers, and ministers, the struggle for independence would have failed.

[edit] No taxation without representation
Americans rejected taxes not imposed by their own legislatures. "No taxation without representation!" was their slogan--referring to the lack of representation in the British parliament. The British countered there was "virtual representation," that is, all members of Parliament represented the interests of all the citizens of the British Empire.

Though Patriots declared that they were loyal to the king, they believed that the assemblies should control issues relating just to the colonies. They should be able to run themselves. In fact, they had been running themselves after the period of "salutary neglect" before the French and Indian War. Some radical Patriots tarred and feathered tax collectors and customs officers, making those positions dangerous, especially in New England, where there were the most Patriots.[1]

Because the New England economy was based upon trade, these new British taxes affected their lives and economy the most.

[edit] List of prominent Patriots
Most of the individuals listed below served the American Revolution in multiple capacities.

[edit] Statesmen and office holders
John Adams
John Dickinson
Benjamin Franklin
Jonathan Shipley
[edit] Pamphleteers and activists
Samuel Adams
Alexander Hamilton
William Molineux
Timothy Matlack
Thomas Paine
Paul Revere
[edit] Military officers
See also: Military leadership in the American Revolutionary War
Nathanael Greene
Nathan Hale
Francis Marion
Andrew Pickens
Daniel Morgan
James Mitchell Varnum
Joseph Bradley Varnum
George Washington
[edit] See also
American Revolution
Rights of Englishmen

[edit] Bibliography
Ellis, Joseph J. . Founding Brothers: The Revolutionary Generation (2002), Pulitzer Prize
Kann, Mark E.; The Gendering of American Politics: Founding Mothers, Founding Fathers, and Political Patriarchy, (1999) online version
Middlekauff, Robert; The Glorious Cause: The American Revolution, 1763-1789 (2005) online version
Miller, John C. Origins of the American Revolution. (1943) online version
Miller, John C. Triumph of Freedom, 1775-1783, (1948) online version
Previdi, Robert; "Vindicating the Founders: Race, Sex, Class, and Justice in the Origins of America," Presidential Studies Quarterly, Vol. 29, 1999
Raphael, Ray. A People's History of the American Revolution: How Common People Shaped the Fight for Independence (2002)
Roberts, Cokie. Founding Mothers: The Women Who Raised Our Nation (2005)

[edit] References
^ Benjamin H. Irvin, "Tar and Feathers in Revolutionary America," (2003) online edition
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_(American_Revolution)"

Never backdown!!!!! No Surrender!!! (Loyalist motto)
A Róisín ná bíodh brón ort fé'r éirigh dhuit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN3weW1udE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJEySrDerj0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyQRprA4NQ

RIP Bronwyn Erin Danniells

 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:27 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (15 of 149) 
 105229.15 in reply to 105229.13 

Okay, but what is wrong with Federalism??

"In particular, the Whigs supported the supremacy of Congress over the executive branch and favored a program of modernization and economic protectionism"

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: SpicyMcHagis  Nov-7 7:30 pm 
To: TheRealMcKoy  (16 of 149) 
 105229.16 in reply to 105229.15 

Nothing wrong with that. I was just dissing on Hamilton who was an apologist for the British. That's why he was never elected President. One thing he knew how to do was stick to a budget.

He made several attempts at trying to gain revenue to pay back depth accured during the war. Those attempts fell short since their was no federal income tax and several states refused to contribute to the depth of the war.

Never backdown!!!!! No Surrender!!! (Loyalist motto)
A Róisín ná bíodh brón ort fé'r éirigh dhuit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN3weW1udE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJEySrDerj0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyQRprA4NQ

RIP Bronwyn Erin Danniells

 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:32 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (17 of 149) 
 105229.17 in reply to 105229.16 

Hamilton's idea of the Republic, along with Jefferson, is what I try to promote on here. We are gradually leaning away from Republicanism and going towards Democracy and Socialistic ideas around government and policy. It is scary, in my opinion.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: SpicyMcHagis  Nov-7 7:36 pm 
To: TheRealMcKoy  (18 of 149) 
 105229.18 in reply to 105229.17 
There never was true "Republicianism." The whole basis of taxes is anti-Repubicianist, yet also very neccessary to keep our country going. With out it they're would be chaos. I am not an ecomonist, but history shows you that both a true "Republic" and a true "Socialist or Communist" government doesn't work for everyone and this country was founded on "We the People." and "Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness." Those words weren't just for one class they were for everyone.

Never backdown!!!!! No Surrender!!! (Loyalist motto)
A Róisín ná bíodh brón ort fé'r éirigh dhuit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN3weW1udE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJEySrDerj0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyQRprA4NQ

RIP Bronwyn Erin Danniells

 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:41 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (19 of 149) 
 105229.19 in reply to 105229.18 

I do know this, but as bad as it sounds, the Constitution really does not apply to everyone. If you look at things like the electoral college, Senatorial appointment, etc., you find out that the elite who are a part of the original political system, did not want the people to choose the leadership, and for good reason.

Look at how some of the people who voted this last election. They did not know policy, the voted strictly for likeness or appearance.

The founders did not trust the average people to make choices, and I find myself hardpressed to do the same.

Representative republic is better than direct democracy.

I hate how people get that wrong, even our President.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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From: TheRealMcKoy  Nov-7 7:48 pm 
To: SpicyMcHagis  (20 of 149) 
 105229.20 in reply to 105229.18 

Surely, you have a take on this.

It's not life, liberty, and free healthcare.

It's not life, liberty, and government handouts.

It's all about rugged individualism.

"...that rib's gotta get sticky"

"In this world nothing can be certain, except death and taxes. That, and SEPTA going on strike every couple of years." - Spicy McHagis

 
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